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Stewart Voegtlin's Mum. 09/12/2011 2:20:00 PM
'Scuse me? How can you lay into bands that have the courage to do what comes from within?
Most of the bands featured on this god-foresaken website look like they have spent too long wanking over NME's cool list whilst looking in the mirror, dreaming of the day they might play at V Festival.
I reckon you're one of those "Have you heard of ? Oh you haven't? Jeez. I know they might have only had 2 E.P's released in Japan in '92-'94, but like HOW don't you know of them?" type of people.
In other words, a music douche.
If these bands were still only playing to crowds of 200 people, you'd be diddling your micro-wang over them.
P.S- You write like an epileptic thesaurus.
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Mr.Ms 01/09/2011 10:12:00 AM
ohhhh critics....what's wrong? Can't play your own music?
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Chris 03/23/2010 4:41:00 AM
Your writing is pretentious. So over the top and trying to be sophisticated that it's a glaring irony to be trying to write a bad review about these groups with a writing style like this. I can't believe the Village Voice even took this on spec.
You don't have to write in an over-the-top manner to get your point across. Seriously. This is crap.
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wes daniel 02/05/2010 9:40:00 PM
will the real stew voegtlin please sit down?...and play 'dead letter office' at 10 a.m. in daffy duck pajamas?..during, before and after tequila shots? with a belly-full of hotdog water, shags and sick movie
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bitter 01/12/2010 10:00:00 PM
you wrote, "The listener is left ultimately with a pointless technical pissing match."
funny, in summing up your article, i'd suggest that "the reader is left ultimately with a masturbatory thesaurus fueled piss fit."
some famous English playwright once quipped, "brevity is the soul of wit."
you might want to tattoo that on your forehead.
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eric 01/09/2010 10:02:00 PM
Dear Stewart Voegtlin,
You're a douche.
-Eric
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uhhuh 01/08/2010 9:28:00 AM
This is one of the most poorly written articles I've ever read. Seriously.
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GentlemanBob 12/25/2009 6:21:00 PM
Oh dear...my head hurts after reading that. Absolutely one of the worst examples of over opinionated thesaurus journalism I've ever read. Opinions are like assholes...Everyone has one
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Ian 12/23/2009 3:23:00 AM
I like this part:
"The listener is left ultimately with a pointless technical pissing match."
Priceless...
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sarah 12/11/2009 12:43:00 AM
wow. its clear this journalist has some sort of axe to grind with pelican or the genre of post metal as a whole. . . verbose though it may be, in the end this article comes off as nothing more than self-righteous, pretentious vitriol masquerading as a faux metal-purist's manifesto. pseudo-intellectual? how's that for hyprocritical? pseudo-emotionality? how presumptuous. "what we all come to need" is a beautiful record and one that's merit should not be judged as subjective taste turned into objective criticism. the beauty of art is that it is experienced on an individual basis. and this individual is moved.
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Lybrium 12/08/2009 12:24:00 AM
Where to start...
First of all, you are suffering from what is called "tunnel vision." You isolate specific attitudes of specific individual's: "decidedly un-metal folks play headbanger by-night..." This is a hideous generalization about ALL fans of these four bands, you are in a bubble, yet speaking as if you're fucking omniscient. How I would love to get this out by just socking you one, but I will talk instead.
Dude lemme tell you something, I grew up on Pantera, sepultera, Living color, Metallica, I grew up loving these bands, and still do. As I grew older I started listening to more varied metal styles, some a helluva lot heavier, some not; Opeth, Tool, cynic, neurosis, gojira, meshuggah, cult of Luna, Callisto, pelican, Russian circles, mastodon, baroness, torche, all shall perish, textures, rosetta, the ocean, Isis...Now tell me that I am a "decidedly un-metal folk" and only "play" headbanger, please, I'd like to here it come out of your silly mouth just to stuff it right back down your undeserving throat.
Self parody is a funny thing isn't it? It saddens me, no really, I'm not just saying that, or this, it really, actually, saddens me, that someone as obviously smart and humerous as yourself, would become so conceded, blind, egocentric...riding on a lower part of yourself, void of humility, yet full of pride. This is something you have been relying on since you were young most likely, built up guilt and regret. It would be best to not to write about things you do not understand in a negative way, if you dont get it, just ask, you CAN make the decision to spread love, not shit.
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DS 12/06/2009 11:44:00 PM
I can't understand what the fuck this article is about. You sound like a doosh-bag.
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Paul t. 12/05/2009 9:11:00 PM
Simply, Voegtlin (as a journo) and Pelican (as a band) are both less important than they think are. The algebra of our accelerated culture has them canceling each other out. Moving on....
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Try To Look Past Your Own Opin 12/05/2009 9:01:00 PM
To the above commenter: link to the well-written article you mention, please, because I see it nowhere in print within the pages of this Village Voice.
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Luc Rodgers 12/05/2009 9:28:00 AM
Thank. Fucking. God.
Aside from the Baroness jab (sure, the statement may have been exaggerated by the speaker because there were not-yet-doable chicks near...they are far superior, however, to the rest of the bands mentioned) this article was such a relief.
I am a fan, and a writer about, metal. My biggest issue lately has been the over-hype of acts such as Pelican and Torche and it is so refreshing to read a well written article with the same views as my own.
Cheers, man.
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Todd Lyght 12/04/2009 12:43:00 AM
That Foley guy bases a response on reader comments and reaction, and then sets up a bunch of straw men to knock down. I can't believe how few people really took the time to read this piece and just started calling this kid a douche and uninformed or whatever. He may be a douche, but it's obvious his argument isn't lacking for information as it managed to piss off three-quarters of the internet. Get over the kid's vocab and get some reading comprehension skills. Fat, drunk, stupid, and mean-people-suck is no way to go through life. TLDR indeed.
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Ray Smuckles 12/03/2009 10:37:00 PM
I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said, and said better (http://www.metalsucks.net/2009/12/02/the-austerity-programs-justin-foley-responds-to-that-eloquent-village-voice-writer/#com-head), but this kind of shit I expect from other New Times papers, not the Voice. Awful, uninformed, and sad. Good work.....I guess.
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Nick 12/03/2009 7:29:00 PM
Did you have to write this? I mean did your editor say "I need two pages of over indulgent writing"? If you don't like the music why promote it? I hear many bands I couldn't give two shits about. Turn on KROQ in California and you'll hear all of them. I choose to not listen. Sure I think "enter whatever band" blows and wouldn't want my kids to listen to it but i'm not about to write about them. I'd rather read about what you do like. I mean can you make what these bands do? Do you play guitar? Or do you just type? Because it's alot easier to sit back and criticize something you have no understanding of.
I mean I fell asleep half way through this. You just run in circles saying the same thing over and over again not really adding any credit to your point. I can see the downfalls in this genre just like any. As I fan I enjoy all the bands you wrote about. I don't blindly follow these bands but listen to them because that's what I like. Why can't fans just like something? Why does it have to be what YOU like? This article is trash.
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"Cool" 9th Grade English Teach 12/03/2009 6:39:00 PM
If it's words without wit, what you've written is shit!
If it's lively and flows, you've got yourself prose!
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Some Random Dude 12/03/2009 11:56:00 AM
"Theres alot of metal bands I don't like, mostly because their to technical. I really dislike Pelican."
Wow no way. I just rewrote your entire article in two sentences without being an asshole. I didnt even need to use google to find fancy words to add an illusion of deep thought to some pointless rambling.
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hellish 12/03/2009 3:12:00 AM
Sums up this ignorant drivel perfectly
http://www.metalsucks.net/2009/12/02/the-austerity-programs-justin-foley-responds-to-that-eloquent-village-voice-writer/#more-25418
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Ste 12/03/2009 1:25:00 AM
Next time, as you wade through your thesaurus, do stop to ponder the word 'succinct'. Cheers.
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Meltzer's Alive 12/03/2009 12:35:00 AM
Who does this guy think he is, me? Guy needs a whatsis update b'fore goin' profane 'n' guttin' sacred bovine:
(1) Write in grunts. Walk on knuckles.
(2) Stay even, Keel. Doth thou offend? Erase. Start over.
(3) Upside dwn goes that frown. Mean people not only suck, they are the most widely read.
Carry on.
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George S Voegtlin 12/03/2009 12:16:00 AM
It shames me to see Stewart still hard at work masturbating over Trans Am and swinging for the Pitchfork minor leagues. I always thought he'd grow out of his beyond-hypocritical "pretentious metal douche" phase. Ah well.
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James Joyce 12/03/2009 12:08:00 AM
Is this tool serious with this shit?
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Ryan Adams 12/02/2009 11:46:00 PM
I don't really understand what "fake emotion" means. If someone is moved by a piece of music, how can it be anything other than "real" response? Relativistic, perhaps, but to insinuate that an entire portion of the population is buying into a fake version of their own experience is really insensitive. By that measure, ANY form of music could be regarded as illegitimate because the writer does not "get" it. And THAT is true pretentiousness, and quite a bit elitist.
This is a prime example of 20th century music criticism that has been on the decline since internet culture has become THE culture. Genre wars and musical hierarchy, populism and "underground", are all fading into the past. Our society is becoming a far more egalitarian plane, in that we don't need allegiance to a small fraction of society anymore, that we are free to roam about and glean what we like from anything we come across. "Fair use" is becoming a way of life, and this kind of writing makes it seem unacceptable to have feelings towards a certain aesthetic.
Also, a friend of mine once barked at a girl that language is designed for us to communicate more clearly our point of view, not shroud it in big words that create barriers between the orator and his/her audience. Please don't try to prove your superior intellect by talking over your audience. That doesn't make you smart, that makes you stupid.
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Downright Hummable 12/02/2009 11:25:00 PM
We're angry as hell at Stewart Voegtlin and were not going to take it anymore!
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Arielle Castillo 12/02/2009 11:04:00 PM
Music editor from your sister paper in Miami here. Just as you say everything about Pelican could be quickly musically summed up, so could this overblown review. You are DEAD WRONG about Torche -- have you taken the time to actually digest their albums? Or did you just lump them in with Pelican because that's what the other indie rock-centric critics do? The bands have very little currently in common. Torche is amazing (or was, anyways, before the departure of guitarist Juan Montoya), and their songs are often downright hummable. Listen carefully before you over-simplify and judge.
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Sighing Loudly 12/02/2009 9:29:00 PM
Pelican : Neurosis :: Stewart Voegtlin : Brandon Stosuy
http://www.slate.com/id/2124692/
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Marble 12/02/2009 8:11:00 PM
You can't use that many adjectives and call yourself a writer. Get a copy of Strunk and White, and find something meaningful to write about. Frank Zappa said it best: Rock journalism is people who can't write interviewing people who can't talk for people who can't read.
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T 12/02/2009 12:44:00 PM
This article = shit sandwich. What a waste of my time.
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LTG 12/02/2009 11:01:00 AM
This was pretty dreadful. Basically this comes across as the opinion of a 12-year-old who spent far too much time with the thesaurus. First of all, there is such a thing as being too wordy. Secondly, two thirds of this article were completely unnecessary. This basically came across as random trivia and poor name-dropping thrown together to make the author's snobbery come across as reasonable, and well-researched.
By the way, am I the only one here who finds the use of the words "faux intelectual" a bit hypocritical?
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Remainnameless 12/02/2009 9:07:00 AM
I love how transparent the author's intention is. Also, his wordsmith muscle flexing literally made me sigh out loud... What a douchebag.
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Stacer Marlowe 12/02/2009 7:48:00 AM
Read this three times and then commnts as many. I don't get why this piece sucks, or is pretentios or poor writing because its mean spirited. Cause it def is. MEAN. But it's right! Are criticisms supposed to be handed out with kid gloves? That's news to me. All of you need to get over yrselves.
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Alee 12/02/2009 6:41:00 AM
Oh and it's a shame that, as I'm sure the writer expects, this thread is basically post-metal defenders vs. post-metal detractors. For sure, the scene's a little lazy and getting long on recycled ideas but this rambling, ungrounded rip-fest is gleefully toxic and hateful to the endeavor of art. How unfortunate.
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Alee 12/02/2009 6:27:00 AM
So this article's thesis is "Pelican=fake metal"? How puerile. It doesn't even attempt to precisely substantiate this claim. This is basically character assassination in cerebral close-reading garb. To paraphrase, "Pelican suck. So do all the other bands that they're friends with. They're not as good as Neurosis and they try to be like Trans Am. Pelican SUCK." Grow up, dude.
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Dan Warren 12/02/2009 5:51:00 AM
Dude, yes. Pelican is totally moving.
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Andrew 12/02/2009 4:59:00 AM
I couldn't even read this thing it was so poorly written. I got the idea by the end of the first paragraph and I really didn't need the following 62 paragraphs to get the authors message, which also happens to be completely wrong and wrong in a very douchey way.
I feel like there is a very specific type of person that listens to post-metal (I also don't lump Mastodon in with that list, they are in fact the opposite of post metal which is prog metal with very few drone parts save some recent songs off Crack the Skye). Despite what the author will have you believe, there is no faux-anything that goes along with truley enjoying the genre. It is a music primarily listened to alone. I rarely pop on City of Echoes during a rager. And if listened to with other people we are usually personally reflecting individual it's not a group activity.
If you don't get it..you don't get it. Most likely because there is nothing to get. It's just a type of heavy music that goes well in certain situations. Leave it at that.
Also, side note, wasn't a huge Pelican fan til I saw them live, and it was probably the most moving musical experience I've ever had.
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Jo 12/02/2009 2:54:00 AM
The piece misspells John Baizley's name. Fact-checking, anyone?
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Jordan 12/01/2009 10:32:00 PM
I don't like Pelican, but critics that dismiss entire genres of music simply because they don't personally like them lose all credibility in my book. There's a sense of bitterness in this article that I'm sure the writer had no intention of conveying, but reared its head anyway.
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GP 12/01/2009 5:29:00 PM
Don't think this piece is writing to the pretense of the "post-metal" bands he mentions. The claim is simple: This music signifies nothing.
Good stuff.
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Wilbur Grinnett 12/01/2009 10:10:00 AM
tl;dr: A meandering, pretentious article complains of the meandering pretense of post-metal. Hilarity ensues.
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crh 12/01/2009 2:15:00 AM
Was it really necessary to write that much about a band as middling as Pelican? I'd much rather read an article about the metal bands you'd like to share with everyone. This article was a waste of time.
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Michael Ironsides 11/30/2009 8:52:00 PM
Great writing. Hilarious comments.
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Metal fan 11/30/2009 10:28:00 AM
One of the most pretentious, uninformative articles I've ever read in a newspaper of any sort. Literary masturbation indeed.
I had been ready to write off Pelican previous to this year, but I've been impressed by the Ephemeral ep and What We All Come To Need. Perhaps not essential music, but certainly quite good.
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Ryder 11/30/2009 3:33:00 AM
This critic seems to know very little about metal. When he wants to name-check "lifers," he comes up with Mot�ad and AC/DC rather than Slayer, Melvins, Napalm Death, or Morbid Angel, who would have been much more relevant. It's a fairly hackneyed strategy to discredit post-rock by drawing attention to its fist-pumping emotiveness ("you think this is for grown-ups because it's instrumental? Really, it's just like Journey!") but this is 1) misguided, because it's intended to strip rock down to its element qualities, and 2) actually wrong, because Pelican really don't sound at all like an instrumental version of radio rock. Anyway, it's kind of ridiculous to come down on Pelican for not being "real metal" when they've gone out of their way to work with guys like Greg Anderson. Mastodon's credibility as metal fans is also not too questionable.
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Jason 11/30/2009 12:29:00 AM
Try getting over yourself and enjoying music. This is an excellent piece of hacksmanship by a douchebag calling the hipster kettle black. Please stop writing.
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roanld reagan 11/27/2009 9:20:00 PM
sometimes people do get sick of balls-out, meat-and-potatoes rock like ac/dc and motorhead. i know i do. i love both those bands, but i don't listen to them a whole lot anymore, because i got bored with it. that's probably why people listen to bands like baroness and mastodon and pelican, it's not just regurgitated blues rock, which is fine, but ultimately fucking boring. do i ever need to hear "you shook me all night long" again? no, i don't, thank you.
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Brian H. 11/27/2009 7:50:00 PM
Not a huge Pelican or post-metal fan in general myself (what ever the heck its called these days -- Baroness, Isis, Mastodon, etc,) but I do like the a few tunes from this genre now and again. But I wouldn't totally dismiss it either. We get it, the author doesn't like it. 2 pages of journalistic masterbation to say you don't like post-metal? Get over it - it is the new prog, its where it has evolved to. Sure its not King Crimson or Rush in quality (or even Neurosis as you mention) but early Mastodon is some quality music and so is a lot of early Pelican (new album, yeah it is weak). This line just killed me, go back and get your masters in journalism, you have a lot to learn:
"But those bands radiate a feral authenticity, with orgiastic crowd-pleasers that double as dry-hump soundtracks and arguments against geometry." Referring to Motorhead and AC/DC.
Come on.. And the Trans Am comparisons? WTF? And throwing Torche in the mix? Obviously the author is very limited in his knowledge of heavy music. Go write a hipster article on Dead Weather or Dave Matthews, seems to fit your style more.
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W 11/27/2009 6:09:00 PM
Writer is a cocksmoker. Couldn't displeasure have been expressed without the use of said"writer's" thesaurus?